17. How to dominate your industry and become number one in Asia - Violet Lim

Are you looking to dominate your industry and become your customer’s number one choice? If the answer is yes, you’re going to love today’s interview.

Our guest is the CEO and Co-Founder of the Lunch Actually Group, Asia’s largest dating company which has arranged over 150,000 dates, and matched thousands of married couples across five countries.

Well regarded by the media as an authority in the dating and matchmaking world, Violet has been featured in over 4,500 media outlets, including The Straits Times, Bloomberg, and CNBC Asia. She was also featured in Singapore’s National Day video in 2005 as one of Singapore’s most aspiring people.

So it brings me great pleasure to have Violet with us in the studio today.

If you’re an entrepreneur, listen in at 25:09 where Violet shares how you can approach differentiation so you can dominate your niche and get your customers to fall madly in love with you. 

Also listen out for Violet’s answers to the following questions:

• You studied law and then became a matchmaker. How did it happen? - 2:20
• Being able to find love is one thing but helping others find love is a different thing. What gave you that confidence that you could help two strangers find love? - 6:22
• Why Lunch Actually? – 13:52
• Why did you choose purple as your signature colour? – 15:22
• Matchmaking was a relatively new concept when you got started. What were some of the initial challenges you faced? - 17:58
• How did you deal with the initial stigma around matchmaking? - 20:51
• You later on expanded into Malaysia. At what stage of your business did you feel you were ready for Malaysia? – 22:22
• How did you have such a global mindset from the get-go? – 23:09
• When you were in the matchmaking business, was there a lot of competition? – 24:06
• When competition started catching up with the emergence of Match.com and dating apps, how did you differentiate yourself? – 25:09
• What’s Lunch Actually’s core competency? - 31:04
• How did you manage to discover your fanbase, the people that would definitely love Lunch Actually? – 32:25
• Now you know that your largest group that you serve are bankers and teachers, how does that help you in your strategy? – 33:30
• Violet, you are number one now. It takes a lot of effort to have that market leadership. What can we do if we are number one in our own industry to stay number one? – 34:35
• You were featured in over 4,500 media outlets. Would you say it’s about paying attention to the media, and then pitching to them along the lines of what they’re most interested in? - 39:31
• How can we become a newsmaker as an entrepreneur or a personality? – 41:05
• Give me your best tip for the singles? – 46:28
• Give me your best tip for couples so they can remain happily married? – 49:10

If you want to keep in touch with Violet, you can reach her on Instagram @violetlim. You can also check out Lunch Actually online at http://www.lunchactually.com.

Read these books to become highly sought after in your own industry -> www.pickericsbrain.com

Thank you for listening to this episode of #HighlySoughtAfter!

If you enjoyed this episode, please help me hit the ‘subscribe’ button if you’re listening on Apple Podcasts or hit the ‘follow’ button if you are listening on Spotify.

I would also love to hear your biggest takeaway from this episode! Here’s how: take a screenshot of you listening to #HighlySoughtAfter and tag me on Instagram. My handle is @ericgoesglobal. This way, I can personally thank you!

Transcript

Eric Feng (Host):

Are you looking to dominate your industry and become your customer's number one choice? If the answer is yes, you're going to love today's interview. Our guest is the CEO and co-founder of the Lunch Actually group, Asia's largest dating company, which has arranged over 150,000 dates and matched thousands of married couples across five countries.

Well regarded by the media as an authority in the dating and matchmaking world, Violet has been featured in over, listen very carefully to this, 4,500 media outlets, including Straits Time, Bloomberg and CNBC Asia. She was also featured in Singapore's National Day video in 2005 as one of Singapore's most aspiring people. 

So, it brings me great pleasure to have Violet in the studio with us today, and I would love you to enjoy the interview, because you're about to learn how to get your customers to fall madly in love with you. Yo, Violet!

Violet (Guest):

Hello. Hi Eric. How are you?

Eric Feng (Host):

Hello. Long time no see.

Violet (Guest):

I know.

Eric Feng (Host):

I want to cry already. Do you know when was the last time we met in person?

Violet (Guest):

I think it's a long time ago. Long time ago.

Eric Feng (Host):

I checked.

Violet (Guest):

Okay, when was it?

Eric Feng (Host):

6 February 2020.

Violet (Guest):

Oh my goodness, that's crazy. 

Eric Feng (Host):

That was even way before COVID-19.

Violet (Guest):

I know, I know. I remember I was thinking, "Okay, I want to catch up with Eric." And then we met up, we had Indian food.

Eric Feng (Host):

Yes, lunch, and we spoke. And then we talk about social media. And then next thing you know. COVID.

Violet (Guest):

Next thing you know I got COVID.

Eric Feng (Host):

Wait, you guys need to hear what she just said. I said, "We had COVID." But notice what Violet said. Violet, what did you just say?

Violet (Guest):

I got COVID.

Eric Feng (Host):

Yeah, Singapore had COVID-19, but Violet got COVID. You were patient number what?

Violet (Guest):

667.

Eric Feng (Host):

Oh my god. You are like the OG. And she looks so healthy today and so vibrant, but anyway, today's not about COVID, today it's about your business. And today's topic is so interesting, because you are really the best in the international matchmaking world.

And when I say best, it's not just a superlative word, but there are numbers to back that up. So, in today's conversation we want to know your journey. How did you build Lunch Actually to be the leading dating matchmaking company here in Asia?

But before that, do you know, everyone, that our dear friend Violet studied law? Hey, she studied law and then you became a matchmaker. What happened? Did Cupid one day visit you and shot an arrow and said, "You're destined to be Cupid?" How did it happen?

Violet (Guest):

I mean to be honest, most of the people listening to this, because I know you have people from five different countries, mostly Asia, listening to this. So, just like you guys, you have been groomed by my parents to study hard, get good grades, get into a good university and get a good job.

So, obviously there's not many choices. Parents always say, "Okay, you either be a doctor, be a lawyer, be an engineer-

Eric Feng (Host):

Or an engineer.

Violet (Guest):

... or an accountant," right?

Eric Feng (Host):

Four. The big four.

Violet (Guest):

So, first things first, I'm scared of blood. So, a doctor is out, right? And then I hate numbers, so accountant is also out.

Eric Feng (Host):

Accountant is out.

Violet (Guest):

And engineering is very technical.

Eric Feng (Host):

It's very much numbers.

Violet (Guest):

I'm like, "Okay, law."

Eric Feng (Host):

Okay, that's a very good way to filter.

Violet (Guest):

Yes. So, I went to law school. However, when I went to law, I was very specific about what I was looking for. I wanted to work with people. So, I thought I wanted to either go into family law, or criminal law.

Eric Feng (Host):

Got it.

Violet (Guest):

But then when I did my internship, my boss was like, "Okay, you go and read up the cases, you follow me to court." And then the more I read, the more cases I attended, the more depressed I got, because family law is very depressing. It's all about divorce, it's about custody, it's about inheritance.

So, I think of me the last straw was I was reading this letter, and we are writing this letter on behalf of our client, and then we were kind of like, "Okay, our client, XYZ, would like to inform your client, XYZ, to pick up their son, XYZ, at what time, what place." I'm like, "That's crazy." The relationship has broken down, and so you-

Eric Feng (Host):

That you need a third party.

Violet (Guest):

Exactly. So, I think I don't want to be doing this for the rest of my life. So, that was the time I decided I was not going to be a lawyer.

Eric Feng (Host):

Got it.

Violet (Guest):

So, the next thing I did was actually I did a masters in HR, because like I mentioned, I've always liked to work with people. So, HR makes sense, right? However, I did my degree in LSE, London School of Economics, and in LSE everybody only apply for two types of job. Either you apply to be an investment banker, or you apply to be a consultant. 

So, I went with the banking route. So, my first job was actually in Citi Bank as a management associate. 

Eric Feng (Host):

Oh my...

Violet (Guest):

Yes. I know, right?

Eric Feng (Host):

That I didn't know.

Violet (Guest):

Yeah, it's like so far away from where I first started.

Eric Feng (Host):

Yeah.

Violet (Guest):

And it was actually there when I was working in the bank where I got the inspiration to start a dating service, because I was a management associate, so I get rotated quite a bit and I meet a lot of different people. And I was quite surprised, I'm like, "Why are there so many singles in the bank?"

Because bankers being bankers, they are illegible, they are attractive, they groom themselves well and things like that.

Eric Feng (Host):

But they probably work too hard.

Violet (Guest):

Exactly. It's like they don't see daylight. I call them vampires. So, that was when I realized that, "Hey, how come a group of my friends they are all getting married, getting engaged, and another group, like my colleagues, were not even dating."

Eric Feng (Host):

Yes, correct.

Violet (Guest):

So, I realized that people who are getting married or engaged, they met either at school and university.

Eric Feng (Host):

So true.

Violet (Guest):

And that's where I met my husband as well. So, about then I also came across this concept of lunch dating, which nobody was doing anything like that then. I mean this was 17 years ago, so there's no apps and things like that.

Eric Feng (Host):

Exactly.

Violet (Guest):

So, I was like, "Oh wow, this is interesting." Rather than keep eating with people you already know, like your lunch kakis, like your colleagues, whatever, why not just meet someone new? And who knows, something might come out of it, right?

Eric Feng (Host):

So true.

Violet (Guest):

So I was like, "Wow, this is exciting." I saw a problem and then I found a solution. And I mean the truth is, I've never match-made anybody up until that point in my life. But what I've done a lot of, is I'm always like the aunt agony of my friends. So whenever they have problems, they'll be calling me.

So, like on one phone, like my home phone, I'll be talking to a guy. On my mobile phone I'm talking to a girl. And then I'm trying to sort out their problems.

Eric Feng (Host):

Mediate.

Violet (Guest):

So, I'm like, "Okay, I think it's probably something I could do." So, that was when I decided to quit my job. So, I was 24 years old then, and decided to take this leap of faith to become a matchmaker.

Eric Feng (Host):

I love it. And you kind of feel like life has already given you a few hints here and there already, right?

Violet (Guest):

Yes, that's right.

Eric Feng (Host):

Rather than fixing divorces, which is so negative, why not help put people together?

Violet (Guest):

Exactly.

Eric Feng (Host):

So, I got it. So, that's how you got started.

Violet (Guest):

Yes.

Eric Feng (Host):

Now, being able to find love, I mean, come on... by the way if you go follow Violet, she's happily in love with her husband. And the way they talk is like they just met and they're really, really very much in love. So, I want to say that you finding love is one thing, but helping other people find love is another.

Violet (Guest):

Oh, totally.

Eric Feng (Host):

Yeah, so what gave you that confidence that you could actually help two strangers find love, or find each other?

Violet (Guest):

You know the truth is that in the early days, because I mentioned just now I started at 24.

Eric Feng (Host):

Correct.

Violet (Guest):

So, in the early days one of the things that I'm most scared of is what if people ask me that question. Because people who were coming to me then, they were usually in their late 20s or even in their early 30s. So I'm really scared they will like call me a fraud or something. "I'm like in my early 30s, you are 24, what makes you think you can help me find love?"

Eric Feng (Host):

Yeah, exactly.

Violet (Guest):

Yeah, and I was afraid like what if the media ask me one day, "You know, Violet, you're just 24, what makes you think you can do this?" So, that was actually something that I'm always really worried about.

Eric Feng (Host):

And do you have a prepared answer for that?

Violet (Guest):

And it's quite funny, so I will tend to like dress older. So I only wear suits. So, if you see some of my earlier photos, I'm always in suits. And the funny thing is nobody has ever asked me that question, and I think you know why? 

Eric Feng (Host):

No.

Violet (Guest):

Because they didn't know I was 24. And there was actually an article, at that time I was 25, the article actually say I was 35.

Eric Feng (Host):

Oh, dear. You're probably quite happy about, right?

Violet (Guest):

Yes.

Eric Feng (Host):

Because you felt like you were older and you felt more credibility.

Violet (Guest):

Exactly. So, that was something that was quite funny. But I think to answer your question, it's true, it's not easy. And in fact, after starting the business I realized that, oh my goodness, I just got so lucky. I just got so blessed. I just kind of stumbled upon my husband at university and we just fell in love.

Eric Feng (Host):

Exactly.

Violet (Guest):

But after starting the business I realized that there's so many different components to it. I know I'm using the word components.

Eric Feng (Host):

And we're going to break it down in a very short while, when you listen to this.

Violet (Guest):

Because if you think about it, it's like, okay, you like a person, but that's just one part of it. The other person must like you back.

Eric Feng (Host):

Exactly. It's dealing with emotions, which is not logical and not structured.

Violet (Guest):

Yes. And then it's like we are like, "We thought it went really well." So, there will be a lot of instances where we are in the office and then we are talking with the matchmakers and everybody's like so excited. Everybody's like, "Oh my goodness, I found a match made in heaven." We are like, "Wow, look at this guy. Look at this girl. We're going to put them together, they're going to go on a date, they're going to fall deeply in love and they'll get married and have kids." And we are all so excited.

Eric Feng (Host):

That feels like heaven. Like you open a department for where Cupid all are hanging out.

Violet (Guest):

I know. I know. But what happens next will be something like they went on a date, and then after that then we call the guy, for example. The guy say, "Oh my goodness, thank you. You guys did such a good job. This is the girl of my dreams." We're like, "Yes."

Eric Feng (Host):

And then?

Violet (Guest):

And then we call the girl, and then the girl will be like, "What the (beep) were you thinking?"

Eric Feng (Host):

Oh, really? Oh, dear. How do you manage that?

Violet (Guest):

So, these are certain things that we have to learn to overcome, for sure.

Eric Feng (Host):

Kind of feel like a recruiters job, like matching the job seeker and the job hunter.

Violet (Guest):

Yes.

Eric Feng (Host):

But I want to go back to that 24, when you started this. Where do you get that confidence? Since you're new to this, I mean obviously you saw a problem and you had a very innovative solution, which is lunch dating, which was so new back then.

Violet (Guest):

Yes, exactly.

Eric Feng (Host):

But were you afraid in those first few years and you just keep doing, even though you are afraid? Or somehow where did that confidence come from?

Violet (Guest):

I think we were very, very blessed, honestly, because I think a lot of businesses they take a while to even get revenue. Like maybe in the first month, second month, third month they wouldn't have much, but for us really from the first month onwards we had revenue.

And it really keep coming. I mean of course initially it was with people we already know. We shared with them, "This is what we are doing." And they were like, "Oh, wow, this is what I've been looking for." But you just keep going from there, and the confidence I think is really a leap of faith.

Because I still remember after quitting my job and then for the first couple of days I'm so lost. I was like telling my then boyfriend, now husband, because I started the business with my husband. So, he already quit his job a while back. So, I'm like, "What am I supposed to do now?" When you're in a job it's very-

Eric Feng (Host):

Yeah, nine to five.

Violet (Guest):

... nine to five, you know what you're supposed to do, you go in. Then I'm like, "Oh, I feel really uncomfortable. How am I supposed to be feeling?" And he's like, "Don't worry, you'll get used to it."

Eric Feng (Host):

Yeah, those of you who are entrepreneurs, you kind of get a sense, right? So, what I'm hearing from you is that you really went in with faith-

Violet (Guest):

Yes, I did.

Eric Feng (Host):

... and because you knew there was a problem. Were you excited to solve that problem?

Violet (Guest):

Very excited. Because I think, honestly, I really am a very obedient daughter. So like I've mentioned just now, I'm an only child actually, so my parents they wanted me to actually climb the corporate ladder. Because they themself, they are small business owners, and then they feel that their friends who have kids who are climbing the corporate ladder, they feel that's so much better.

            So that's actually what they wanted for me. That's why they worked so hard to put me through university, go to a good school, things like that. So, honestly, I think if I did not find something that I'm passionate about, I wouldn't have left my job. So, this was something that I was like, "Wow, I can help people solve their problems. It's something that maybe I can actually do well in."

That was the reason I love it. And actually there's another episode where I have to tell my parents about this.

Eric Feng (Host):

Okay, it would be very cool. How do you do it?

Violet (Guest):

So, because my parents of course at first they're like, "Oh wow, my daughter is going to be a lawyer." They're very happy. Then next I broke the news to them like, "Sorry, I'm not going to be a lawyer anymore." Then they thought banker, also not bad, right? So, the next thing is i have to break this news to them.

So, my parents are in Malaysia. So, I remember taking the coach back with Jamie, my husband, back to Malaysia, and then sat them down. I'm like, "Daddy, mommy, I have something to tell you." So at that time we're not married yet, so maybe at first they were quite excited.

Eric Feng (Host):

They're like, "Yay, you guys are going to get married."

Violet (Guest):

They thought, "Oh my goodness, you guys are getting married." Then I'm like, "I'm going to quit my job." Then already you see their face, they're not very happy with you. They have a very blank face. Then I say, "I'm going to start a matchmaking company." They said-

Eric Feng (Host):

Jaw drop.

Violet (Guest):

Yes, really, jaw drop. Because you know there's this saying in Chinese like, [Chinese 00:12:10].

Eric Feng (Host):

Oh my go. Okay, we need to translate that. This is so good.

Violet (Guest):

So, that means don't be a media person, don't be a guarantor, and don't be a matchmaker-

Eric Feng (Host):

Don't be a matchmaker.

Violet (Guest):

... and your three generations will live happily ever after.

Eric Feng (Host):

I had no idea there was such a thing.

Violet (Guest):

Yeah. And I mean at that point I just jinxed three of my generations, right?

Eric Feng (Host):

Yeah, absolutely. You just did. So, how did you manage to convince your family then?

Violet (Guest):

So, they are also very smart. Of course by then Jamie already has left his job, because Jamie, actually he's very entrepreneurial. He didn't know what he was going to do yet, but he already quit his job to try out different things. So, when I shared this idea with him, he was like, "Wow, this will work."

So they are like, "Okay, why not you just ask Jamie to do it full-time, so Jamie we know you are here, you can do it full-time, but since you still have not quit your job, you do it part-time and then you work together and see what happens next?"

Eric Feng (Host):

Wow, [inaudible 00:12:58].

Violet (Guest):

It's very logical, very practical, makes sense.

Eric Feng (Host):

Yes.

Violet (Guest):

But I think I'm the type of person that I either go 100%, 150%, 200%, or I don't go at all.

Eric Feng (Host):

Not one leg in, one leg out.

Violet (Guest):

Yes. Because I don't want to have to what if? I don't want to like let's say I fail, and then I will keep thinking, "What if I have left my job?"

Eric Feng (Host):

Oh my god, this is so powerful. For those of you who are right in transition, and I'm pretty sure a lot of you guys are probably thinking, "Should I quit my day job and go pursue my passion, or do something I want to do?" You've got the answer.

Violet (Guest):

Yes. So, I mean they were not too happy about it, but I finally understood why I studied law. So using my persuasive skills, I managed to convince them. And I mean since then they have been our biggest supporter of course now.

Eric Feng (Host):

Oh my god, that's so sweet. Thank you so much for sharing that backstory. Now, we want to dive into the whole Lunch Actually evolution. So, now we know that you wanted to do the lunch date thing, but why do you name it Lunch Actually? It's a very cool name, but why?

Violet (Guest):

Thank you. So, again, we're not so smart. So, what we did was that we came up with a lot of names. So it was like those kind of crazy times where like in the middle of the night you're sleeping and all of a sudden you wake up, "Oh my goodness." Then you go to the computer, write it down in your Excel sheet, that sort of thing, right?

Eric Feng (Host):

Correct.

Violet (Guest):

So, we had over 100 names, and then we get it down to-

Eric Feng (Host):

Narrow it down.

Violet (Guest):

... about like maybe 10. And actually our favorite name is, you have to listen to this, our favorite name is A Lunch Martini. 

Eric Feng (Host):

Oh dear. I'm so glad you didn't pick that one. A Lunch Martini.

Violet (Guest):

And we like it so much we already got the designer to start working on the logo. But again, thank god, we decided to put it out for our friends to vote.

Eric Feng (Host):

Thank god for friends.

Violet (Guest):

Exactly. So, we put it out and everybody hated A Lunch Martini, exactly like your reaction.

Eric Feng (Host):

Yeah, because martini, it's alcohol, but so what?

Violet (Guest):

And it's so pretentious and things like that.

Eric Feng (Host):

Oh, that's true. No offense to martini lovers, okay.

Violet (Guest):

Yes. So, everybody loved Lunch Actually, because that was just a year after the movie, Love Actually.

Eric Feng (Host):

Love Actually. So, it's true. It's based on that movie.

Violet (Guest):

Yeah. So, then everybody was like, "Oh, that's really nice. We really like it."

Eric Feng (Host):

It's cute.

Violet (Guest):

And then we thought we should go with the majority, even though our favorite is A Lunch Martini.

Eric Feng (Host):

Thank god you didn't go by your own intuition.

Violet (Guest):

Yes.

Eric Feng (Host):

Because after all they are your market, right?

Violet (Guest):

Exactly.

Eric Feng (Host):

So let your market decide for you.

Violet (Guest):

Yeah. So, since then, Lunch Actually.

Eric Feng (Host):

Then another question, why purple? By the way, if you y'all don't know this, I've met Violet at least three times, and she's always in purple. Any of you that runs a fashion company, please go sponsor her. Shades of purple. Lilac can also-

Violet (Guest):

Yes, I have multiple dresses, because it's so difficult to buy purple clothes.

Eric Feng (Host):

Supergirl. Supergirl's one of my friend's company.

Violet (Guest):

Okay, awesome.

Eric Feng (Host):

Go reach out to Violet, sponsor her.

Violet (Guest):

So, this is another great idea by my husband. So, what happened is that after we started, eventually we got some press. People started wanting to interview us, and then he's like, "Hey, why not every time you appear on media, just wear purple?" Then I'm like, "Oh, yeah, that's sounds like a good idea."

Eric Feng (Host):

Because of your name, isn't it?

Violet (Guest):

I mean, no, the company name is already purple.

Eric Feng (Host):

Oh, okay.

Violet (Guest):

Why the company color is purple. Okay, let's talk about that.

Eric Feng (Host):

Purple. Yes, why?

Violet (Guest):

Because red is so in your face. Whenever people think of love, you think of red. And then we were like, "Do we want to [inaudible 00:16:13]." So, it's just old fashioned like we just talked, right?

Eric Feng (Host):

Yeah, too in your face.

Violet (Guest):

Then we thought, "What is a color, which will make people really trust you?" So, that will be blue, right?

Eric Feng (Host):

Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Violet (Guest):

But then blue is so boring.

Eric Feng (Host):

Corporate.

Violet (Guest):

Yeah, it's too corporate. So, we're like, "Oh, purple is great. It's like blue-

Eric Feng (Host):

Red and blue.

Violet (Guest):

Yeah. And it's a royal color. And then I mean it also helps my name is also like purple, Violet, right?

Eric Feng (Host):

Yeah, your name is Violet.

Violet (Guest):

So, it all kind of made sense. So, that's why we went with purple, which I think was a great choice of color. And then eventually the extension was that my husband said, "Why don't you just wear purple every time you go on media?" Because he say it's like you can't be wearing you company logo, so you might as well wear a shade of your company.

Eric Feng (Host):

Exactly. Thank god, not Lunch Martini, otherwise you dress up as a martini, you know what I mean?

Violet (Guest):

Yes.

Eric Feng (Host):

But that is so powerful.

Violet (Guest):

Or an olive. But anyways, so I did that. And the thing is I'm not much of a fashionista. So when I shop, I'm like I better just buy a couple clothes in case I need to wear it for media. So, eventually 85% of my wardrobe is purple.

Eric Feng (Host):

Oh my god, we need to insert a B-roll for that one, and then take a look at your wardrobe. By the way, those of you who are watching us on YouTube, you would see our backdrop is actually purple. So absolutely great for branding purpose.

Violet (Guest):

So, it's quite funny. I remember there was a time when I wasn't even interviewed for the TV news. It's something like there's an interview and then the minister was being interviewed, but I was just in the background. And then my friends say, "I saw you on TV there." I say, "Huh? I wasn't on TV." "You were, you were, I saw on the background like this. This purple person is you, right?"

Eric Feng (Host):

It's either Violet or Barney.

Violet (Guest):

Exactly.

Eric Feng (Host):

It's one of them. Okay, I love this connection. So now, question, matchmaking, very new concept in the early 2000s, more so even in Singapore, right?

Violet (Guest):

Yes.

Eric Feng (Host):

So, were there challenges when you first started? Even though I know you said that you already started making your first dollar, but were there some challenges that you faced with matchmaking?

Violet (Guest):

For sure. It's so funny.

Eric Feng (Host):

Give us a few.

Violet (Guest):

So, the first one is that we have problem finding an office. So at that time, it was 2004, so actually the economy was not doing so well, and with the budget that we have allocated, we could have easily gotten a office. But then after we went and look at it and then we are like, "Oh, we like this." And then the owner start asking our agent, "What do your tenant do?"

            And then they're like, "Oh, they are in the dating business." And then the owner said, "Sorry, it's too advanced for us." They're very nice, they use the word advanced. And the rest of their tenants are what I used to do, like lawyers, bankers, management consultants.

Eric Feng (Host):

So they felt like this cannot compare.

Violet (Guest):

Yes. So, it was quite funny, but they did offer us another building now, which is grade B. So, I thought that was so interesting that we couldn't actually get the location of our choice. So, that was one. The second thing was that of course once you have a business the next thing is you want to advertise, you want to let people know about it. But of course, remember, this is early 2000, there's no social media, so it's all about print ads.

            So we went to the newspaper and we say, "Hey, you know we want to put out an ad." And they're like, "Oh, can't, can't, can't, go and put it in classifieds." 

Eric Feng (Host):

Looking for girlfriend. Preferably a certain age. Oh my god.

Violet (Guest):

And then we were like, "No, that's where we do not want to be." Because we really want to be differentiating from the more traditional maybe companies in China Town and things like that. We want to differentiate from them. We say we want to be in the main page. They're like, "Sorry, you cannot."

Eric Feng (Host):

Oh, wow.

Violet (Guest):

So, the next thing that happened was that we talked to a number of people and finally there's this guy, he's like, "Okay, okay, I let you put in one insertion. That means no discount." Because you have to buy multiple insertions to get discount. So he say, "Okay, one insertion and then we see what happens."

Then we are like, "Okay, fine. We'll take it." So, we put it out and the next day of course a lot of people call us and including the other news people also call us and they say, "Why don't you advertise with us?" I was saying to myself, "Well, we tried." So, those were some of the things that we went through, which is really interesting to think about it, like the stigma attached to it.

And then there was another time where, at our office, and then we hear ting tong. So, someone went and open the door. Then we were like, "Where's the person? A ghost. Where's the person?" Then after that we found a guy at the pantry opposite our office, hiding.

Eric Feng (Host):

Why? Embarrassed, or he was shy about it?

Violet (Guest):

So, that's the thing that's so interesting, because we are actually in an office building on the 21st floor. So, what are the chances you bump into someone you know? But because the stigma is so big, he's really worried about being seen outside the door of a dating company.

Eric Feng (Host):

Oh my god. So, the biggest challenge you faced back then was that stigma?

Violet (Guest):

Yes, the stigma is huge.

Eric Feng (Host):

And how do you deal with it? I mean we know in marketing you also go for a ready market. Like the market's not ready. How do you make them ready?

Violet (Guest):

Okay, so the good news is that they are not ready to tell other people that's how they met, but they are at least a bit more ready to at least come to us. But of course we did a lot of different things as well, so I think the name is something. We didn't say we are like passion, like cupid or something, it's really like Lunch Actually.

Eric Feng (Host):

It's still quite corporate.

Violet (Guest):

So in a way you know, you know. You don't know, you don't know, that sort of thing. So, I mean some people still that we are restaurant, but anyways. So, that's one part of it, and also we did a lot of creative advertising. So, for example, that ad we actually put out, it wasn't like a lot of couples, lovey-dovey.

In fact, the ad we put out, there were no images at all. And that was the funny thing, like usually when people get our ad, they always call us again. "Hey, did you forget something?" Because we actually did a copy ad and it's like half of the space is empty.

Eric Feng (Host):

Oh my.

Violet (Guest):

Yeah. So, and then the ad kind of goes like, "Half a million of Singaporeans do not read. Is that the reason why they're single?" And then like then it's copy, it just kind of say they are blah, blah, blah. So, it's like we try to go on the very quirky, very smart, very creative sort of thing. So, people really took attention of that.

Eric Feng (Host):

Fantastic. And let's dive deeper in a short while, because I have some question to ask you about differentiation, which is a very big part of dominating an industry. So, I got you. So, that was your big challenge in Singapore, the stigma. And then you later on went to Malaysia. So at what stage of your business you felt you were ready for Malaysia?

Violet (Guest):

So, that's also the thing that a lot of people ask me about, and I think it's really how we decided from day one. So, not even like when we are ready. It's like from day one we knew that we are not going to only be in Singapore. Because we are in a very small country and in a very niche market.

Eric Feng (Host):

Correct.

Violet (Guest):

So, if we are going to just be in Singapore, then I mean again there's nothing wrong with mom-and-pop business, but I think just for us from day one we knew that we wanted to be bigger, so we knew that in order to do that, that means we have to expand.

Eric Feng (Host):

And see, you have to understand that back then when you had that mindset, [inaudible 00:23:04], there was no social media, you were still very much of a local mindset, right?

Violet (Guest):

Yes. Exactly, yes.

Eric Feng (Host):

How do you end up having that kind of mindset? For people to tell me now that, "I want to go global," it makes sense, because they are so exposed, right?

Violet (Guest):

Yes.

Eric Feng (Host):

But back then you were not exposed, or I assume so, so why do you have to count on such a big mindset?

Violet (Guest):

I think like I just feel if we are going to do something, it's economies of scale. I don't put so much effort in building the system to do so many of these things and I'm only going to help just this group of people. I really want to be helping more people. So, I think maybe it's a very interesting question.

Eric Feng (Host):

Yeah, because I mean I was an entrepreneur as well, but because when you say you started a business [inaudible 00:23:46]. I was in my sophomore year in the US, and I also back then was doing a bit of training, but I really never have your mindset. My mindset was, "Oh, if can train a few secondary schools, I'll be very happy." I did not whole mission. Could it be the way you were brought up?

Violet (Guest):

I think maybe it could be... I think you know I was Malaysian, so I converted to Singaporean five years ago. So, I think with that I now thought of like Malaysia as like maybe another country. So I think with that it was just more like I started in Singapore and then now it's kind of like homecoming, right?

Eric Feng (Host):

Back to home. [crosstalk 00:24:18]

Violet (Guest):

Yes. So, like with Malaysia I never thought it was going to be very difficult in that sense, but then the next one we went to Hong Kong.

Eric Feng (Host):

Exactly. That's very far away.

Violet (Guest):

Yeah, it is quite far away. So, for Hong Kong it was, again, in a way a personal thing. Like for me I've always liked Hong Kong. I remember visiting my girlfriend at the time, I was studying A-levels in the UK and I have a lot of friends who are from Hong Kong. And then they invited me to visit them, so I stayed with them and things like that.

And I must say I love Hong Kong, I love the energy, I love the vibrancy. So, I always told myself, I said, "Okay, next time I want to work in Hong Kong." I know, right? 

Eric Feng (Host):

This is so cool. It still goes back to following your heart. It's not about just all about dollars and cents, but it's about I enjoy this market, so I'm going to find opportunities.

Violet (Guest):

But of course I cannot just go into a market just because I want to work there.

Eric Feng (Host):

Exactly.

Violet (Guest):

So, I mean we did our research, we talked to people, and then we also have clients. By then like maybe they worked in Singapore and they went back to Hong Kong, or I have friends who were in Hong Kong, they know what I'm doing, and they're like, "Hey, you must really come here. There's really a market for you here."

And of course a lot of people initially they were very skeptical, because they are like, "Hong Kong, people don't need help there. They can just go [foreign language 00:25:27]," and things like that.

Eric Feng (Host):

Oh my god, exactly.

Violet (Guest):

But I mean the truth of the matter is they do need... I mean not they need help in a very negative manner. It's just that everyone works so long hours, so I think the demographics in Hong Kong is very similar to the one in Singapore.

Eric Feng (Host):

To Singapore. Or actually any cities for that matter, back then?

Violet (Guest):

Yes, for sure.

Eric Feng (Host):

Now, so, I kind of get a sense of why. You were just basically... your expansion plan has a lot to do with economy of scale. But the second one is also that you were listening a lot to your customers, and they were telling you, "Hey, there's a market there." And then you do your research and plus it's a bonus because you like the country.

Violet (Guest):

Yes, exactly.

Eric Feng (Host):

Okay, now a very important question, then we'll dive deeper. Differentiation. So, back then when you were in the matchmaking business, were there a lot of competition already?

Violet (Guest):

I would say there's different stages of competition, because when we first went in, of course there are the existing companies. I mean of course they are-

Eric Feng (Host):

The big fishes already.

Violet (Guest):

No, no, no. They are more traditional sort of matchmaking companies. So there were some of them. The match.com and the dating apps, they're in yet at that point.

Eric Feng (Host):

Okay, very good. So, I maybe we talk about phases. So, at the beginning, you were competing with a lot of the traditional dating companies.

Violet (Guest):

Yes, that's right.

Eric Feng (Host):

And how do you differentiate yourself?

Violet (Guest):

I think that one was very clear, because that's why even in terms of marketing, we didn't want to do the classifieds.

Eric Feng (Host):

Classifieds.

Violet (Guest):

Yeah. We really go in your face. We even did MRT ads.

Eric Feng (Host):

Oh, like train ads basically. How does it work?

Violet (Guest):

So, the one when you go up the escalator, so we did a series of that. And then I mean, again, very blessed. We have this amazing designer. I mean now he's super famous, I say his name or his company, you'll be like, "Oh my goodness." But at that point he was starting out, and so we were starting out at the same time.

And then he helped us with that particular campaign, so it's a very smart campaign. So, you know like how in the MRT you always have things like a fine if you eat or drink.

Eric Feng (Host):

Yes, $500.

Violet (Guest):

Yeah, things like that, right? Exactly. So, we play on that. So, it was kind of like, "No lunching alone. Fine; five million." "No being single," whatever I can remember the exacts.

Eric Feng (Host):

Oh my god, that is so cool. Because Singapore is a fine city, right?

Violet (Guest):

Exactly.

Eric Feng (Host):

So you fine them for being single, you fine them for not going for lunch.

Violet (Guest):

Yes. That idea, and it's kind of like buy the order of Lunch Actually, something like that [crosstalk 00:27:41]. So it was really smart. And in fact, SMRT liked our ad so much, they say, "You just print more, those stations have nothing, I'll put it up."

Eric Feng (Host):

That's so awesome. So okay, I'm taking notes here. So, number one is that already you were doing the opposite.

Violet (Guest):

Yes.

Eric Feng (Host):

So there's a saying in marketing, at the beginning you don't want to be better than your competition, you want to be different. Because people are wired to spot differences, and I get it from you.

Violet (Guest):

Yes, exactly.

Eric Feng (Host):

So, very good. So, at the beginning you were doing everything that's opposite of what your competition was doing.

Violet (Guest):

Yes.

Eric Feng (Host):

Then after that, phase two, there's that match.com, the online world start catching up. How do you differentiate yourself then?

Violet (Guest):

It's very clear, because we are totally different. Because they are online, we are offline. And in fact, there's a lot of compliments, because people who use online, or even now with dating apps, they will feel that, "Wow, I'm using a third party to help me." Because in a way a lot of people to take that step to use a matchmaker or to go to a dating service is a big jump.

Eric Feng (Host):

That's true.

Violet (Guest):

But now like anybody who's single, you just say, "Hey, are you using this app? That app?" It's a very normal part of the conversation.

Eric Feng (Host):

So people are very open these days to use the apps.

Violet (Guest):

Yes. So they are already taking that step. So, even though an app is not a person, but it is a third party. So, of course there are people who succeed with apps, and that's great. But there are also a lot of people who do not succeed with app as well, so that's the time where you are thinking, "Oh, this didn't work. So, what else can I try?"

Eric Feng (Host):

And that's when they look for you guys.

Violet (Guest):

Yes.

Eric Feng (Host):

So, would you say that in your phase two it's about doubling down your uniqueness?

Violet (Guest):

Yes.

Eric Feng (Host):

Because ultimately the core of your dating is lunches, right?

Violet (Guest):

Yes. Again, I wish I can say I'm so smart and we did that.

Eric Feng (Host):

You should. I mean you should say that.

Violet (Guest):

No, no, because we didn't. We didn't do that.

Eric Feng (Host):

Oh no, then what do you do?

Violet (Guest):

We did a lot of different things. So, I mean I know you for so long and then I think I also want to be very upfront and honest with your listeners as well.

Eric Feng (Host):

Yes, please.

Violet (Guest):

I don't want to just tell them all the good things, right?

Eric Feng (Host):

Yes, because unfortunately I'm a fan, you see, so I only see the good stuff.

Violet (Guest):

Thank you.

Eric Feng (Host):

So, tell us the process?

Violet (Guest):

So, we did go into all these different things. We did start our own online dating platform, we did go into apps, so we did. So, one of the things that we felt we needed to do, which I think a lot of entrepreneurs would end up doing is, "Oh my goodness, there's a new competition. What do I need to do? Okay, let's try and do what they are doing."

Eric Feng (Host):

Exactly. It's very instinctive.

Violet (Guest):

So, we did that.

Eric Feng (Host):

And how was it?

Violet (Guest):

So, I think there's some success. So, there was this particular product that we did, that it went quite well, I think for at least five, six years, but then eventually then it didn't do so well anymore, and then we eventually kind of closed down that particular product.

Eric Feng (Host):

Got it. Okay.

Violet (Guest):

So, and yes, then the next thing of course which makes sense is to double down on what we are already good at. It took us a while to realize that. So, this is now what we are doing. So, we realized that actually rather than kind of chase all these shiny things, we should really just focus on our core competency and how do we expand on that core competency?

Eric Feng (Host):

This is powerful. And this is so important, because for a lot of us, especially now you realize our competition is no longer just the local country but it's the world, and you start to see what all your competition is doing and you felt that FOMO, the fear of missing out.

Violet (Guest):

Yes, exactly.

Eric Feng (Host):

Like, "Oh, they're doing apps. I need to do that." "Oh, they are starting a new program. I need to do that." So you were doing that as well.

Violet (Guest):

Yes, we were.

Eric Feng (Host):

So, guys, if you are also doing that, then don't feel like you are missing out, because we've all done it. But it did not work out as well as it used to, your original plan?

Violet (Guest):

Yes, it didn't.

Eric Feng (Host):

So, tell us a bit, what's your core competency? What's Lunch Actually's core competency?

Violet (Guest):

So, I think what we do really well is really to make sure people meet up, and then when they meet up, like it's an authenticity to it. Because I think the problem with the apps, I mean again, we have done apps before and I have friends in the app industry, so there are definitely people who have succeeded with that.

But at the same time there are also different issues. So, I think what we are able to do is that whenever I put someone in front of you, this person has been screened, has been vetted. I've gone through so many different matches to give you this match. And this person is real, you are 60, 70% of what this person is looking for, the person is 60, 70% to what you are looking for, and we make that date happen.

Eric Feng (Host):

And that is exactly your core competency, which is a little bit different in the online world.

Violet (Guest):

Yes.

Eric Feng (Host):

But that is very good for us to apply, which is that we need to go deeper into what are we good at. Where is our superpower?

Violet (Guest):

Yes, exactly.

Eric Feng (Host):

Even if we are an insurance agent, what is your unique superpower?

Violet (Guest):

Yes, definitely.

Eric Feng (Host):

Or if I'm a educator, what sets me apart from everybody else? Why am I able to do so naturally well? In your case was you're very good at matching real people together, you're good at siffing out and have a quality match.

Violet (Guest):

Yep, that's right.

Eric Feng (Host):

I love that. Would you also say that you were very clear about who's your target market?

Violet (Guest):

Hmm...

Eric Feng (Host):

Because you see, it's not just about helping all singles. I mean all singles, there's a lot of them. But how do you manage to discover your fan base? Like these are the people that naturally definitely love Lunch Actually.

Violet (Guest):

I think, again, it's like my inspiration, which is my colleagues, which actually up until today, very interestingly, because we just hired an intern to do some data analysis for us. And up until today, one of our biggest occupation group is still banking.

Eric Feng (Host):

And you started there. 

Violet (Guest):

Yeah, exactly.

Eric Feng (Host):

In fact, you were inspired by that, right?

Violet (Guest):

Yes, exactly.

Eric Feng (Host):

Oh my god. Okay. Even now, because that's 16 years-

Violet (Guest):

Yes, even until today, it's like 17 years ago.

Eric Feng (Host):

... 17 years, you're still serving the same market you started with that market.

Violet (Guest):

Yes. I mean of course we serve other people as well-

Eric Feng (Host):

But the primary.

Violet (Guest):

... but the biggest percentage is actually banking, then followed by... I mean of course teacher is actually a big part of our-

Eric Feng (Host):

Of your market.

Violet (Guest):

... market. Like healthcare. I mean of course there are still a lot of the other ones as well.

Eric Feng (Host):

So, now with this information that you know that actually you are very good with the banking industry, you're very good with the teaching industry, how does that help you in your strategy?

Violet (Guest):

We do look at how we can work with them more. So, definitely LinkedIn is one of our marketing strategy. People have said to me like, "Oh, Violet, I just saw your LinkedIn," because it's so unusual. LinkedIn is very, very business-

Eric Feng (Host):

Very corporate.

Violet (Guest):

... very corporate. Yeah. So, definitely LinkedIn is one of the strategy, and also just see where they are. I mean but other than that, we do do performance marketing, we do continue to work on organic growth in terms of media and things like that. 

Eric Feng (Host):

So, would you say that at the beginning you were serving whatever market that was closest to you?

Violet (Guest):

Yes, that's right.

Eric Feng (Host):

And then it evolves, but it's very nice to constantly check back again, and who are really your real audience.

Violet (Guest):

Yes, that's important.

Eric Feng (Host):

And then double down on your competency, double down on your biggest markets.

Violet (Guest):

Yes, for sure.

Eric Feng (Host):

And go where you're celebrated.

Violet (Guest):

Yes, yes.

Eric Feng (Host):

Guys, this is beautiful. I hope you guys are taking notes. All right, now the last part of today's topic... no, actually before I go to that last part, Violet, you are number one now. That's a Chinese saying. [Chinese 00:34:39].

Violet (Guest):

Okay.

Eric Feng (Host):

When a tree is high, it attracts a lot of wind, right? It takes a lot of effort for you to have that market leadership. What can we do when now we are number one in our own industry, how can we stay number one? Obviously we don't want to be number two. We like being number one [inaudible 00:34:56]. Give us some advice, how do we stay on top?

Violet (Guest):

I think one of the things that I always have is I feel very uncomfortable when you say you're number one, or you say you're the best. I feel very uncomfortable whenever people say that to me, because I feel that I'm still very far from where I want to be. So, I think for me my mindset is always like I'm not there yet.

Eric Feng (Host):

Nice.

Violet (Guest):

Yeah. So, I'm constantly like, "Okay, I'm not there yet, I need to do more, I need to look at how things are going. How can I even be better?" So, I think maybe that's one part of it. And the other part of it is, I don't know, maybe it's my achiever profile or something, I'm not sure whether you are familiar with Enneagram?

Eric Feng (Host):

Oh, yours is Enneagram number three?

Violet (Guest):

Yes, number three.

Eric Feng (Host):

Okay. By the way, go search Enneagram, you'll see there's altogether nine types.

Violet (Guest):

Yes.

Eric Feng (Host):

Okay, so it's your personality.

Violet (Guest):

Yes, it's my personality. And I think if you have done StrengthsFinder, I'm not sure if you have done that?

Eric Feng (Host):

I've done, and one of my strengths is achiever.

Violet (Guest):

Yes, mine's also achiever.

Eric Feng (Host):

High five. Oh my god, okay. So, two things. Let's break it down. Number one is, I love the number one one, because number one is independent personality. That means you have a growth mindset.

Violet (Guest):

Yes.

Eric Feng (Host):

That means as long as we keep growing, then it really doesn't matter, right?

Violet (Guest):

Yeah. So, I never think about am I number one, number two, or what? Because I'm sure along the way there will be better people who come in, but I don't want to think about... so focus on the ranking.

Eric Feng (Host):

So, would you say that your reference points is never your competition?

Violet (Guest):

Yes.

Eric Feng (Host):

Your reference point is who you were last year.

Violet (Guest):

Yes, for sure. So, I'm constantly thinking, "How can I be better?" I'm looking at different industries, how do those people be sort of like top of their industry. So, I never keep thinking, "Oh, I'm number one."

Eric Feng (Host):

Beautiful. So, two things I learned from you. Number one is to constantly compare with yourself, the past.

Violet (Guest):

Yes.

Eric Feng (Host):

So you're always improving. But number two you give us a very good idea, which is don't go and look at your current own industry, because you might be blindsided, or blind spots, right? But go look at other people's industries, and then whatever that they're doing, let's say the media industry or the entertainment industry, you borrow those things and then put it into your own industry.

Violet (Guest):

Yes.

Eric Feng (Host):

I love that. That feels like a mashup.

Violet (Guest):

Yep. And I think the other thing is I'm very open to new things. So, again, I don't know whether that's my personality or something, I'm always willing to try new things, and even though it's very out of this world. So, the latest thing we did was the live streaming for matchmaking. 

Eric Feng (Host):

Oh, I didn't know that. Please tell us more.

Violet (Guest):

So, we did last live with Lazada. And then we did a matchmaking show on last live-

Eric Feng (Host):

On a Lazada platform?

Violet (Guest):

Yeah.

Eric Feng (Host):

Wow, Lazada's selling people too now, matching people. Okay, how was it?

Violet (Guest):

It was really fun. So we did four episodes and I finally know, oh my goodness, it's so difficult to produce a show. Because virtually it's like every week, and then we have to have content, not just me showing up and doing this whole live streaming thing. But we need to have videos that we already produced to show what happened with the singles, because we can't bring the singles up every time.

Eric Feng (Host):

Exactly, so the backstory.

Violet (Guest):

Yes. So, it was quite crazy, like suddenly become like a production house.

Eric Feng (Host):

Who came up with this idea? Lazada or you guys?

Violet (Guest):

It was just kind of like really along the [inaudible 00:38:06] thing. Like we always thought it'll be quite interesting to work with e-commerce, because again, it's a very new thing to us. And then somehow we started talking to Lazada, and then at first we were just talking about having a store and things like that.

Then they start saying, "No, we can give you live." And I think then I thought why not we do a matchmaking show? So from then they were super supportive from maybe just one epi, they started giving us more epi, and it was really fun.

Eric Feng (Host):

Fantastic. Well, this is great stuff. So, this is exactly how we can constantly be number one, not in the market, but number one in our own world. Always just being better.

Violet (Guest):

So, I think maybe another story, and it is relevant-

Eric Feng (Host):

Yes, please.
 
 Violet (Guest):

... it's like when we first started, I worked with media agencies, like PR agencies as well. And sometimes my PR agency would tell me, "Okay Violet, we cannot do so much stories. You cannot keep getting in the media. You know you'll get overexposed."

Eric Feng (Host):

Okay.

Violet (Guest):

Yeah. But what I've learned is that there's nothing called overexposed. It's only like whether you have what they want from you. Because as a company or as a founder, there's so many different parts to you. Like for example, Eric, you are not just an educator. You are an entrepreneur, you understand maybe a certain market very well, [inaudible 00:39:19]. There's just so many ways to-

Eric Feng (Host):

Facets of us.

Violet (Guest):

Exactly. So, it's really about giving them what they need.

Eric Feng (Host):

Very nice. So, would you say that, that means because you were featured in 4,500 articles and stories, but you're telling me that it's about, first of all, paying attention to that media company, what kind of news and stories are they most interested in, and then you pitch along the line of what they're interested in?

Violet (Guest):

Yes, yes. I think a few things. Like first and foremost is that you need to be like the news maker that the media wants to work with, because I think a lot of times people don't get it. Because I mean same with me, honestly, the first time I get on newspaper or I get on TV, I'm like, "Oh my goodness, it's like huge." And I'm like, "Oh my goodness, this is like my childhood dream."

Eric Feng (Host):

Exactly.

Violet (Guest):

And I think eventually I realized that it's really not about that. It's about why they actually ask you to go on TV, or why they ask you to go on radio, or why they are writing a piece about you. And I think sometimes people just get so excited and then they over promote themself, and that's something that the media hates.

Because imagine you are like the DJ and then you only have 10 minutes, and then you invite this guy to come onto the show. And I remember this very clearly, because I went on a radio show and then there were two interview with me, and this other guy. And then it's like the other guy... and sometimes the PR agency also give this kind of advice, they will be like, "Oh, every time you get a chance to, say your company name. Every time you get a chance to, pitch something that you are selling."

Because they see it as very, I feel, short-term, because they think, "Oh, this is the one and only show-

Eric Feng (Host):

The only chance, yeah.

Violet (Guest):

... that I'm ever going to be on." But imagine you're the DJ, you'll be so irritated.

Eric Feng (Host):

Because the DJ's trying to create a piece of news.

Violet (Guest):

Yes, the DJ is trying to create value for the listeners.

Eric Feng (Host):

So, you said this right, we need to be a news maker. How do we do it? Or give some example of how can we, as an entrepreneur, as a personality, start to become a news maker?

Violet (Guest):

I would say look at what they want to write about, because I mean obviously unless you're an [inaudible 00:41:22], you want to look at the trends, you want to look at what are the stories that are coming out. And then from there you want to give feedback to what your opinion is. Then you can pitch to them, and then they'll be like, "Oh, that's quite interesting. I now see it from this angle." For example, again, I am not familiar with insurance stuff.

Eric Feng (Host):

No, in your world.

Violet (Guest):

Oh, in my world.

Eric Feng (Host):

I want to know your thought process on how you create news.

Violet (Guest):

So, how we go about it is like when we go into any market, there's the announcement. So, that's a very easy thing. Because first, we are the first matchmaking modern dating agency in Singapore, for example. We went to Malaysia, we are the first in Malaysia. We went to Hong Kong, we are the first in Hong Kong.

Eric Feng (Host):

You are the first to do a live dating thing.

Violet (Guest):

Yes, exactly.

Eric Feng (Host):

So, being first create news.

Violet (Guest):

Being first, for sure, create news. For sure.

Eric Feng (Host):

Okay, what else?

Violet (Guest):

Next is trends. So, like media loves trends. And I think for our industry, I guess because people have to write about it, I'm not insurance, I'm not property.

Eric Feng (Host):

It's like dating, love, matchmaking, people love that.

Violet (Guest):

So, we do a lot of surveys. We are constantly doing surveys. So for example the most recent survey we did is like what do singles think about vaccinations?

Eric Feng (Host):

Yes, because the hot topic now is on vaccination.

Violet (Guest):

Yes, exactly.

Eric Feng (Host):

But your market is the singles, so you combine these two things together. The media took it.

Violet (Guest):

Yes. So, with that we got covered.

Eric Feng (Host):

Okay.

Violet (Guest):

So, there's definitely trends. 

Eric Feng (Host):

Number three?

Violet (Guest):

And then you talk about... okay, let me think.

Eric Feng (Host):

Stories. You mentioned stories. 

Violet (Guest):

Yes, we do a lot of stories. So, I think as a person, you are not just... like for me, I'm not just a matchmaker. I'm a mother, I'm a wife, so I do get covered in all these different things as well. So, mother magazine, they do cover me. So, entrepreneur magazines they want to hear like your backstory, and different angles. So, another thing that got us very far in Hong Kong was actually we did what we call a celebrity dream date. 

Eric Feng (Host):

Oh, okay.

Violet (Guest):

So, again, you need to understand the market and you need to understand the location. So, Hong Kong is very big on celebrities. So, when we first started we were like, "Okay, how are we going to make noise?" So we thought, "Okay, why not? We get a celebrity to experience what lunch dating is all about, and then see how it goes from there?"

Eric Feng (Host):

Correct.

Violet (Guest):

And so again, very blessed, of course it will be a bonus if she really end up with who we match her up with, right?

Eric Feng (Host):

Yes, of course.

Violet (Guest):

But she really did.

Eric Feng (Host):

Oh my god. And the credibility for you.

Violet (Guest):

Yes. So they got married, they have kids. So, we are always known as like the company who matched this lady. So, I mean the celebrity's called Ella Koon.

Eric Feng (Host):

Ella Koon, okay.

Violet (Guest):

Yeah. So, she's a singer, she did some acting as well.

Eric Feng (Host):

Got it. So let me summarize that. So, I pick up four things on how to capture the attention of the media. So, the first one is being first. If you are the first in doing something, the media wants to feature that. Number two is trends. What are some hit topics that people are talking about? Offer your point of view, or do some data analysis and share that data with them.

Number three is stories. Are there any highlights in your life, or are there any interesting backstories that's inspiring, funny, or touching? And then you share those stories. And the last one is pay attention to what that market, what does the country or media love to cover? So, if it's more of a celebrity magazine, they'll probably want to feature celebrities. Combine that with your area of expertise. You might end up getting something new.

Violet (Guest):

Yes. And don't be afraid to experiment. So, another thing that we did was like you know when Pokémon GO came out?

Eric Feng (Host):

Yes.

Violet (Guest):

And then I went crazy. I was like hunting Pokémon with my kids, and then my poor husband is driving us everywhere. And that particular weekend I was like, "Wow, this would make a really good story." And that weekend itself I activated my team. Like StrengthsFinder, another of my strengths is activator.

Eric Feng (Host):

Activator.

Violet (Guest):

Yeah. And then we created dating goal, and we did it across all the countries we are in, and we got picked up by the news.

Eric Feng (Host):

How does it even work, dating goal?

Violet (Guest):

Dating goal is basically we just get singles together and then we put out [inaudible 00:45:23] and then they just go around hunting Pokémons together and then they get to know each other.

Eric Feng (Host):

Oh, it's still using the Pokémon app, but you contextualize it as a dating experience.

Violet (Guest):

Yes. And that was crazy, because first time ever. Because usually people do not like to tag their friends on our social media, because it's like so shy, right?

Eric Feng (Host):

Correct.

Violet (Guest):

That's the first time ever everybody was tagging their friends. They're like, "Hey, you like Pokémon GO, right? Go and join this event."

Eric Feng (Host):

Oh my god. See, so again, it's looking at what's popular and match it with you, but the mindset we need to be, is we need to be experimental.

Violet (Guest):

Yes, for sure.

Eric Feng (Host):

Because the minute we are experimental, we start to do things that's different, or new and unique, and that's what creates news.

Violet (Guest):

Yes.

Eric Feng (Host):

Now we all know how she ended up being on 4,500 newspaper articles. Now Violet, thank you so much for sharing with us you backstory and then how do you dominate your niche, and then even PR tips. I cannot let you go, I'm so sorry. Even though I know this is supposed to be a 45 minute thing, I do injustice to my followers and listeners if I don't at least ask you the last question.

So, the last question is going to be on love. We make it easy. Give me your best tip for the singles? And then later on give me your best tip for couples to remain happily married, okay?

Violet (Guest):

Yes.

Eric Feng (Host):

Go for it.

Violet (Guest):

Okay. 

Eric Feng (Host):

Violet, go.

Violet (Guest):

Violet, go. I think my best tip for singles, I will say like go join Eric's KLR.

Eric Feng (Host):

Oh, no, come on, I never planned that. She's being nice.

Violet (Guest):

No, but why I say that-

Eric Feng (Host):

Okay, why?

Violet (Guest):

... is because I think a lot of times singles when they are looking for love, they don't look at themselves. They are always just looking like, "Okay, what do I want?" And they are making this whole list, I call it like the checklist syndrome, right?

Eric Feng (Host):

Guilty. I have one. 

Violet (Guest):

I mean it's fine to have a list, but I think sometimes people just overdo it. But I think more importantly is really to look at ourself, and I really love your KLR, because it's you need to known, be loved and be respected.

Eric Feng (Host):

Exactly.

Violet (Guest):

And I think that's really self-work, it's really inner work. So, I think if we work on ourself, we know what would attract other people to us, because obviously it's like when we're attracted to someone else, there's something about them that we are attracted to. And a lot of people they always ask me the question, they say, "Hey, Violet, I have this friend now, very [Chinese 00:47:35], very good, everything good."

Eric Feng (Host):

[Chinese 00:47:37] means pretty, by the way.

Violet (Guest):

"I don't why she's single." I'm like, "I don't need to meet your friend, I know why already." Then they are like so impressed. They're like, "Why?" I say, "Okay, since your friend is so good, so pretty, so good, everything good. Like good career, nice person, friendly, everything's so great. So, let's say if you score her, on a scale of one to 10, how would you score her?"

Eric Feng (Host):

She'd be probably be a nine.

Violet (Guest):

Okay, we give a bit lower.

Eric Feng (Host):

Okay, eight.

Violet (Guest):

Eight. Okay, eight. Let's say if she's an eight, what do you think she's looking for?

Eric Feng (Host):

Yes, exactly. She'll be looking for an eight at least, or a nine.

Violet (Guest):

No, no, she's definitely looking for a nine, okay?

Eric Feng (Host):

Okay.

Violet (Guest):

And what is the nine looking for?

Eric Feng (Host):

Nine is looking for 10.

Violet (Guest):

Exactly.

Eric Feng (Host):

So they'll forever and ever be looking, it's like a dog chasing the dog tail, right?

Violet (Guest):

Correct. So, that's why I say your friend now has two very simple solutions. One, is she make herself a 10. So, that's why we still have to join Eric's KLR.

Eric Feng (Host):

Thank you.

Violet (Guest):

Yes, okay.

Eric Feng (Host):

Or?

Violet (Guest):

Or you just be open to people around you. There are so many people around you that they might be a seven, they might be an eight, they might be an eight point two, and they're perfectly great people. But you are just using this yardstick in your mind, that thing like, "Okay, I must be this tall, I must be this good looking, I must be this whatever to be a nine." And you are actually missing out on a lot of opportunities.

Eric Feng (Host):

Oh wow, this is so beautiful. Listen very carefully to that. Re-listen to it if you are single. So, there are two ways to look at it. Number one, is sure, you can rate yourself as an eight. Or no, so you can have a checklist that has a whole bunch of things, but you better make sure you also have all those things.

Violet (Guest):

Yes, and more.

Eric Feng (Host):

And more. If not, why would that person want to be with you?

Violet (Guest):

Exactly.

Eric Feng (Host):

So, it's all back to your self-awareness, knowing what makes you attractive, but it's also about self-work.

Violet (Guest):

Yes, for sure.

Eric Feng (Host):

I love that. Married couples.
 
Violet (Guest):

Married couples. Okay. So, for married couples, I think those who are getting married, please spend more money and effort not on your wedding planning, but on your marriage planning.

Eric Feng (Host):

Ooh, go to the core.

Violet (Guest):

Because I think a lot of people kind of say, "Oh wow, I'm at the finishing line. The wedding is the finishing line." But no, that's just the beginning. 

Eric Feng (Host):

Victor, if you're listening to me, Victor is my osteopath, he's proposing to his girlfriend today on seven/seven.

Violet (Guest):

Oh, nice.

Eric Feng (Host):

Victor, this is for you. He spent so much effort on that wedding and the proposal, but you're right, proposal and wedding is only one day, but marriage is-

Violet (Guest):

Yes, and that's just the beginning. The marriage is a lifetime.

Eric Feng (Host):

Good luck to you, bro.

Violet (Guest):

So, I think really look at marriage like a plant. So, you need to water it, you need to put fertilizer, you need to put in the sunlight. I mean sometimes people just kind of like hope that it'll just grow by itself, but it doesn't. So, I think if you just keep that in mind to realize that in order for a marriage to work, for a marriage to be beautiful, fulfilling, long lasting, you need to constantly be looking after it and spending time and effort and resources on it.

Eric Feng (Host):

I love it.

Violet (Guest):

And I'll end with one last thing-

Eric Feng (Host):

Please.

Violet (Guest):

... which is I read this and I was just so touched by it. So, there's this guy, he is in his 70s, and then this journalist asked him, "So, what is the secret to your long lasting marriage?" Which he's married for more than 50 years. And then his answer, okay, you all have to listen very carefully, because the first time-

Eric Feng (Host):

Taking notes.

Violet (Guest):

... I heard it, I didn't get it. "We never fell out of love at the same time."

Eric Feng (Host):

Could you say that again?

Violet (Guest):

We never fell out of love at the same time.

Eric Feng (Host):

Oh.

Violet (Guest):

So, I mean I'm sorry to burst the bubble of some of our lovebirds out there. So, I have been married for a long time. I have been with my husband, I think this is our 21st year together, but we have been married for 16 years. So there are definitely times where we are not lovable to each other.

Eric Feng (Host):

Yes. Just not at the same time.

Violet (Guest):

Yes. We just want to kill each, definitely at times like that. So, I think this is something to be aware of, because like what this old man has said, the secret is that someone was always holding on, someone always feel that the relationship is important enough to work on, and someone just keep working on it.

Eric Feng (Host):

That's so beautiful. Thank you so much, Violet. This is, even though I'm not married, but this is so useful. All right, with even business partnerships, or with family.

Violet (Guest):

Yes.

Eric Feng (Host):

Because it's also a partnership, right?

Violet (Guest):

Yes, for sure.

Eric Feng (Host):

Wow, you know what, Violet? You truly are Asia's number one, in my world at least.  I know you don't like to be called number one, but in my world at least you are number one matchmaker.

Violet (Guest):

Thank you.

Eric Feng (Host):

Thank you so much. All right, high five.

Violet (Guest):

Yay.

Eric Feng (Host):

Yay. What a great way to do today's interview. Now so there you have it. This is Violet sharing with you how to dominate your industry and to be your customers number one choice. Now obviously there were a lot of things I took away from Violet, but I think my biggest takeaway has got to do with the differentiation that I think is extremely important that we stop looking outwards to try to find our own branding and to find our own uniqueness.

It's kind of ironic, you can't find your own uniqueness by looking outwards. You've got to look inwards, and you've got to focus on what are your superpowers. What are things that you do naturally well, which you call your core competency? And rather than just move [Chinese 00:52:32], go deeper into that core competency and see how you can expand on that. So, that's one.

Number two, I learned from her about mashed up, which is don't look at your own industry, but go and look at other people's industry, because it's different. And think of it allows you to come up with very new ideas and new ways to actually rejuvenate your entire business and entire work. So, I definitely want to try that.

For me, I look at the matchmaking world to see how I can apply that into the education world. The last one, which I took away, and it was so powerful, is experimentation. I think sometimes we forget that running a business it's not meant to be work, it's meant to be play. And look at your kids, our kids... I mean not that I have a kid, but kids don't have to fret about what toys to play, they just play.

And I feel that if we can treat our business as a form of play, to be open to new experiences and experiment, have fun, and even when we fail, we fall forward, then you know what? We're always going to be way ahead of the competition, and that's actually how you'll be trailblazer and let your competition take a smoke. All right, if they see your smoke, they know you're far away.

So, that is my takeaway, and I hope that you guys got more takeaways. Now we produce podcasts like this once every week and we post them on YouTube. So, if you loved this interview, you'll love the rest of the interviews. So, remember to hit the subscribe button, hit the bell notification, and I'll see you at the next video.